4 comments on ““Awkward” Creepers

  1. Thanks for this. I was just having this discussion with a friend the other day; we were both concerned that we were being ableist in claiming that everyone should be able to respect boundaries. But this shows that the ableism definitely isn’t coming from our side.

    • Yeah. You’re not the one saying that people with social obstacles just can’t help but seem like sexual predators because goshdarnit they’re just savages and they can’t be civilized. That’s what’s ablist, and a loooot of people try to go that angle for the sake of enabling their creeper friends.

      Totally out of line though.

      Here’s a great example. After performing at a burlesque show, men can get sort of handsy with me (but only in “friendly” ways like putting an arm around my shoulder or running their palm along the skin of my arm), and on one occasion I was trying to edge away from a guy and just repeatedly angle my body so that he couldn’t keep hold of me and he kept re-approaching until a guy in our group said something to me.

      Now, this guy is probably about the most classically “awkward” person I know. He’s bad at reading nonverbal (or even verbal) social cues and he knows it. He asked, “Do you want to stand over here?” and indicated a spot between our group and the wall where creepers would have to get past three or four sympathetic friends of mine to touch me. I took him up on that offer and at this point I consider all creepers to have officially lost the “awkward” excuse.

      This guy is awkward, but he sincerely gives a damn about people. Consequently, if he’s not sure whether someone will be comfortable (which is frequently), he will JUST ASK. In words! Almost like I am a person or something!

      Furthermore, it was obvious enough that I was uncomfortable that he could tell, which suggests to me that the man touching me could too, because in a social situation he looked pretty fuckin’ comfortable to me. Comfortable enough to put his hands on strangers. He just didn’t give half a fuck how I felt.

      So yeah, I’m done making the “this person is just on the autism spectrum” excuse, and you shouldn’t let anybody make you feel shitty about asking for civilized behavior from people like, say, Aspies. “Callous asshole” is not on the autism spectrum.

      • I have Asperger’s Syndrome, one of the main reason I don’t go to support groups is that the men all act as if they are entitled to you. From “But you know there are less Aspie women than men, uuuWAAAH!” To acting like a pathetic crying baby over being rejected. It seems that their parents never taught them, or they never learned that in order to get a girlfriend you need to act like an adult.

        It’s ableist according to some people to point this out, to suggest that it’s okay to create boundaries against men with forms of Autism, because don’t you know they’re just poor little babies who don’t know what they’re doooiiiinnnnggg. It seems to never occur to them the notion that people with forms of Autism must be regarded as forever children is far more ableist, than suggesting men who have forms of Autism understand how to behave around women.

        I had a realization today, the reason I fear people with Autism and more so men, I do not know how they will react towards me. I don’t know if they will try to touch me, I don’t know if their parent will try to manipulate me into spending time with their poor son who can’t get a girlfriend with a sob story, and manipulate me into a social situation in which I try to get out of said parent will moan and put on a drama about how nobody will ever love her child..more “uuuWWWWAAAHH!”

        I’ve found that parents of children with Autism can be manipulative in getting people to spend time with their children, so they can live the fantasy that their child is neurotypical. I had a father suggest I was his son’s girlfriend, his son who I had heard sexually harassed a woman at the job he worked at. I didn’t say anything, I felt I couldn’t say anything, the father would start acting as if I was being indignant for rejecting his son. And this is the main reason why I find being around people on the Autism spectrum so difficult as a woman, you will be punished if you say no.

        There has been so much advocacy built up around Autism spectrum disorders, that it seems if anyone complains about their behavior, they will have to hear a lecture on how their child can’t help it. Guess what, this reasoning is the root of why there is stigma against people on the Autism spectrum. People don’t like being around people who they cannot say no to.

        This makes things extremely difficult for women, who if they say no to a man who has a form of a Autism, will have to then deal with the tantrum one would expect of a 10 year old rejected child. They will have to deal with them running off to the principal, the teacher, their parents and start bawling about how meannnn the girl was to them. Now, think about how terrifying this is for a girl who is being harassed by a man with Autism, perhaps sexually, and everyone they go to just tell them “Well he doesn’t understand.” Then you’re always the bad person for standing up to them. You can’t push them away or, “UUUWAAAAAH!” you can’t say no or, “UUUWAAAAH!”

        We’re telling women because of society’s notion that men are entitled to them, they are wrong for telling men who have Autism no. Because our society wants to treat people with Autism and raise them as forever children, they’re never taught that the same rules others obey apply to them. Instead what you end up with is the equivalent of a spoilt child in an adult male body, who’s never been disciplined, or told they did wrong. Now, what will happen when this man wants to have sex? They will act the same way as a 10 year old boy who wants a toy. You give it to them or “UUUUWAAAH!”

        I think it’s disgusting that women should have to accept this as the interaction they have with men on the Autism spectrum. I think men should be offended that this is their legacy, and try to behave better. A woman shouldn’t have to fear being harassed, molested, ect when they are around a man with Autism. Yet, they are because they are treated as if they’re telling a 10 year old boy, that they are bad. 10 year old boys don’t have a sex drive which they are not in control of, it is unlikely that a 10 year old boy would rape a woman, or coerce her to sleeping with him with tears and “Buh buh I have Autism uuuWAAAAH! Sleep with me or I’ll tell!”

        In fact most of my depression, what led me to feeling completely hopeless, was the idea that from being in these Autism support groups my life would be having to interact with these types of men. It did not occur to me until this morning it was because there always was a level of fear I had that I would be sexually harassed and be unable to do anything about it, that I was powerless, because they would believe the poor blubbering baby over me.

        I appreciate you making this post, and giving me an opportunity to get out what society says I should not. That I shouldn’t say that advocating for the rights of people Autism, is good, but not if it means men who don’t understand social rules or boundaries when it comes to sex are let loose on society. Not if it means when a woman says a man with Autism keeps touching her, that she has to understand he doesn’t know. That she will be made the bad guy, the one who picked on the poor little manboy, should she defend herself against him. To think that I would have to live my life amongst people who would use and treat me like a object, a thing, that depressed the hell out of me. Even worse, that I was told if I expressed this, I was a horrible human being.

  2. Pingback: The “Why I Need to Call Some Men Creepy” Linkdump « Dissent of a Woman

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